Raising Wild Hearts
An inspirational show focused on growth from challenge and ideas to take the path less traveled. Ryann Watkin interviews experts and shares resources on education, creativity, nature, spirituality, mental health, relationships, self care, and more. Ryann is a passionate speaker, mom, wife, and educator who asks questions that provoke self-awareness, meaning, and purpose. Psychology, spirituality, family— and where they all intersect— is the heartbeat of Raising Wild Hearts.
Raising Wild Hearts
Healing Generational Trauma & Letting Go of Judgment with Anastasia Arauz
Today we're joined by an expert in family systems theory, Anastasia Arauz! Wondering how to foster a balanced and nurturing environment at home? Anastasia's wisdom, drawn from her extensive background in elementary education, counseling, and play therapy, promises to enlighten and empower parents and educators alike. She shares practical strategies for healing family structures, emphasizing the importance of authenticity parents and children.
💕Find a Registered Play Therapist in Your Area Here
💕Follow Anastasia on Instagram
💕Check out Anastasia's Website Here
If you feel inspired please consider sharing this episode with a friend, writing a 5⭐️ review or becoming a Raising Wild Hearts Member here!
In my way and the way I think about it is we're all here for a purpose. We're all here to do something, and it's really we're guiding them to be able to do that, to be their authentic human self.
Speaker 2:Welcome, revolutionary Mama, to the Raising Wild Hearts podcast. I'm Ryan Watkin, educator, mom of three, rebel at heart and passionate soul on a mission to empower and inspire you.
Speaker 2:Here we'll explore psychology, spirituality, parenthood and the intersection where they all come together. We'll discover how challenges can be fertile soil for growth and that even in the messy middle of motherhood, we can find magic in the mundane. Join me on my own personal journey as I talk to experts and share resources on education, creativity, self-care, family, culture and more. I believe we can change the world by starting at home, in our own minds and hearts, and that when we do, we'll be passing down the most important legacy there is healing, and so it is Healing, and so it is. Hello friends, welcome back to the Raising Wild Hearts podcast. So excited that you're here, as always. Happy 4th of July, which just passed if you're listening to this on the day that it airs on July 8th and happy summer. We're like in it. We're smack dab in the middle at this point and I hope you're having a great summer here. We've intentionally chosen not to do a big travel summer like we have in the past, but we are in Michigan right now, as you're listening to this, for a little bit longer and we are probably on the lake and eating twisty ice cream cones with rainbow sprinkles and having some family time. So, yeah, I hope you're having some time this summer to kind of slow down and enjoy. So today I have an amazing interview to share with you. I hope you enjoy it as much as I did.
Speaker 2:I'm talking to Anastasia Aroos. Anastasia is an accomplished professional with a diverse educational background and extensive experience. She's got a degree in elementary education, a master of arts and counseling. She spent five years as a middle school teacher and nine years as an elementary school counselor. Anastasia is also a registered play therapist, which we talk a bit about in the episode.
Speaker 2:I think I've mentioned it before. One of my kiddos has done play therapy and I absolutely love it and I'm a huge advocate for it. So since 2022, anastasia has also expanded into coaching and collaborating with schools and parents to foster a healthy mindset for building balanced family systems. And she says with her commitment and wealth of experience, she is a valuable resource for education, counseling, play therapy and family coaching, and I know that you guys will hear that come through in the episode. She's a wealth of knowledge. You're going to enjoy this conversation so much. There were like multiple light bulb moments for me and some really practical ideas to bring into your family to make it a more balanced family system, like Anastasia says. So, without further ado, enjoy my conversation with Anastasia Aroos. Anastasia, welcome to the Raising Wild Hearts podcast.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here, yes.
Speaker 2:I'm so excited to have you. This is six months in the making, as we talked about before we hit record, so it's going to be a magical one. I just know it. I want to start off in the place of family systems. So I think some of us hear this word thrown around, or this phrase thrown around, and I want to know from your take just let's go 101. What is a family system? And then also, what does a healthy family system look and feel like?
Speaker 1:Yeah, of course. So what I? So? I know there's family, internal family systems, which a lot of people are talking about right now, which is IFS. This is similar to that, but I take all mine out. I mean, I've done a little bit with IFS, but most of my stuff has come from family systems theory, which is a theory from a man named Murray Bowen. He was a psychiatrist many, many years ago I think 30s and 40s and he created this family system theory, and so I really like it a lot because it's research based, it has been used and talked about forever and it was just one of the foundations of just family, and so I've really enjoyed learning about that, and so that's what I love to teach the families I work with.
Speaker 1:So basically, what it is is that we cannot be, as an individual, understood in isolation from other people, right? So you are part of your family, your nuclear family. Initially it's an emotional unit, and so, basically, we're all connected, we're all independent individuals, and so you cannot be understood in isolation because it's a system, right? So if you think of a car, if you have a tire on your car that's flat, your car is going to be like bump, like not moving smoothly. So if you have a member in the family that's struggling with anything like it could be, so if you have a member in the family that's struggling with anything like it could be a child struggling, an adult struggling the system's going to get out of whack. And so what I like to think of it is like let's put this system, let's look at the whole thing and figure out how I can help, and that's what I do.
Speaker 1:Another real interesting part to family system theory is that we all grow up in this system with a role to play. Right, we're all assigned to this role Not necessarily we want it, but it just gets assigned to us from the time we're born. And then everyone expects us to respect that role. And if you start to change, people not consciously but maybe unconsciously start to feel some kind of disconnect. They don't understand and they want you to get back to the role you're supposed to be playing. And so a lot of times, a good example of that is when kids leave to go to college. College is a great time of growth and change, and so when the child comes back, a lot of times they're very different, and that family is going to work their hardest to get that person back to that role they're supposed to be playing. And it works sometimes. Sometimes it doesn't. It just kind of depends on the individual of the person, and that's basically. I don't know if that makes sense, if that's what I think of family systems theory, totally Okay.
Speaker 2:So there's like the artistic one. There's the people pleaser, there's the Okay. So there's like the artistic one, there's the people pleaser, there's the easy one, there's the grumpy one, right Like. Everybody gets all these little kind of nicknames or it might even be. Probably a lot of times it's unspoken, I would imagine it's interesting.
Speaker 2:What first came up for me when you were describing the roles is my role as a daughter, now as a grown woman to my mom, and she sees me, I think, from her perception she's like wait a minute, what's all this change? Who is this person? I don't know you, I have no idea, and she's kind of like panicking, I think. And so it's this interesting dance being a grown person, a grown daughter, my own person, who still my mother, wants to mother me and thinks that I'm this person still. Yet I've grown and, you know, had all these variations of me. So that's the first thing I thought of. And then also how, you know, I think Ned, then as a mother, and how do I not put my own children in these sometimes limiting roles? So how, as parents let's look through that lens for a minute Do we not put our kids in these boxes?
Speaker 1:That is such a great question and I think it's such a daily conscious thing you have to do being so present with your kids.
Speaker 1:For example, I have a son that is 12 or 11. I don't want to make him older, he's 11. And this week he is at camp and I know there's going to be so much growth from him when he comes back and it's going to be challenging for me because he hasn't written to me, I haven't heard from him and I know he's just really becoming. He's 11, right, he's beginning sixth grade and this is a huge change, and so for me it's going to be just a very conscious choice of letting him be that new part of himself. So an example of how that would work would basically be not when he starts talking and if it's not something I agree with or something he's learned at the camp, maybe that doesn't fit in our family just hearing him talk about it and not putting my judgment with it and just letting him speak. So really trying to keep our judgments away from our kids and letting them grow to be their own special little human.
Speaker 2:Isn't that interesting. I love that. It's been something I've been exploring for a number of years my own judgment, which, quite honestly, starts with myself. I feel myself judging myself, or I feel myself perceiving that I'm being judged by others, and I don't know if that's the truth or not, but I'm like, oh, so-and-so might be judging me, or the lady at Target because my toddler's having a meltdown is looking at me with the side eye. I must be a terrible mother, I feel that. And so let's double click on the judgment piece a little bit. Maybe some self-judgment, some perceived judgment from others, where does it come from? And maybe what's the antidote?
Speaker 1:It's so hard, right? I think we all do it Like, just we want our kids to fit in these little boxes, especially when we're at target or on an airplane, and they don't necessarily want to fit in that box. So I think a lot of times it's just really knowing who you are and being very clear on your personal expectations, your personal values, your personal beliefs about what your family is, and to just try to think about that when your child's not doing exactly what you want to do. I think it gets hard sometimes as kids get older, especially when we have to make a decision about something for our family. And then an example would be my child plays soccer, right, and so they do sleepovers or they'll do different things.
Speaker 1:And maybe I don't want the child to go to someone's house to sleep over because of my own things. But then I'm like, oh, what are they going to think of me if I don't want the child to go to someone's house to sleep over because of my own things? But then I'm like, oh, what are they going to think of me if I don't let them go? And maybe I just don't want them to go because I don't like the video games that they play in their home or I don't like the way they talk in their home and that is healthy for that family system.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love that you brought it back to self-awareness and self-discovery, because when we can stand in our own truth pretty fiercely and without apology, I think that's a good foundation to be that leader of the family system. Because one thing I always say in our house with my husband and our three kids is we are the leaders, like we're not the bosses, we're not the you know the dictators most of the time, but we're the leaders and so we lead by example and everyone kind of falls into line energetically and what we do and what we say and all of that. So I love that you brought it back to self because it feels like at this point I'm not that far in. I'm not quite as far in as you because my kids are still younger than yours, but it feels very much like, okay, this is an inside job.
Speaker 1:It is, and I think just being very, um, giving yourself grace, right, because it's not going to be perfect all the time and you're going to make mistakes and you're like, all right, that was, I should have not done that, I should have not said that, and just every moment's a new moment and every day is a new day and just giving yourself grace and I have had to really work on that myself because I'm a therapist, I've been working with children for over 20 years and I do things like all the time I'm like why am I doing that? Why am I saying that? But that comes back to how I was parented a lot too, and you have those tracks in your head, and so learning how to get those tracks out of your head is really hard. And so, yeah, just giving yourself grace is really important.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we got to ski the fresh snow for anybody who's like a snowboarder, skier, you got to like, make the new tracks in your brain because it really does. We get so used to. You know, these little things that we say are little habits, and so, yeah, becoming aware of that is so key. Let's talk about generational trauma. It's something I didn't realize was a thing until I became a mom. I think that becoming a mother times three was the catalyst for me, the biggest catalyst thus far in my personal growth and development personally, and I realized oh my God, there's generational trauma here. All of this is old stuff. Much of this is not even my own. It's my cultural and familial expectations of what it means to be a woman and a mother, a daughter, a sister, right? So let's talk a little bit about generational trauma. Maybe for someone who's like what is that? Do I have that and what is that? How does it manifest day to day?
Speaker 1:Yeah, totally. So I think it's such I mean it's such like a hot topic right now, and what I love about it being a hot topic is it's true and I don't think we thought about that in years and years ago and we are now able to see that there is generational trauma and that we can help people through it. So basically what it is, it's trauma that extends from one generation to the next and you don't even know what's really happening. It can be everything from I mean, this is pretty severe but sexual abuse. If you were sexually abused and you didn't necessarily get help or you didn't know how to deal with it, you possibly could abuse your child and not not even wanting to, but it's like something that is just within you.
Speaker 1:Or, most of the time, if you were sexually abused by someone, that it's been going on generation and generation and generation. So physical abuse is the same way, emotional abuse, all of those types of things that continue or they're from previous generations and then they just continue from one family to the next. And so it's really important to know that, know that it's something you can change and that it's hard, it's not easy changing that, because if you were, say, verbally abused. That's what you heard growing up, and so it's like you know you don't want to do that to your kids, but it can happen and it can. You can say these things that you've heard over and over and then be like why, why am I saying that? And it's okay. So then it's just like take a step back and redo it.
Speaker 1:And the other really cool thing about being able to redo things is kids are very forgiving, and so, as you're learning how to get out of this trauma that you've been in and you've made mistakes with your kids, really just repairing kids are great and they're the easiest people to repair with and that's when you can stop the trauma, because they understand and then that's not buried deep inside of them and you're stopping it right there. So I really love to help parents work on that, because so many of us that grew up in the 80s or 90s or even 2000s have a lot of stuff buried because no one knew how to talk to us about it. And now we're learning that we can talk about it with our kids and we can get it out, and then it's not being buried, it's not stuck, they're not going to have to have years and years of therapy because you're repairing and you're doing the work with them.
Speaker 2:Totally. For me it feels like this calling, almost, so to speak, like this kind of spiritual, like deep I'm here for a reason, type of thing of like all these things that were passed down and those are likely different for all of us, yet universal in this way, right, you know, it's like this is what I'm here for now. Like I feel a really strong calling through motherhood not passing these particular things down to my children Again, definitely not perfect, definitely screw up all the time and always say I'm sorry. And I love how you said kids are the easiest people to repair with. That's so true.
Speaker 2:You try to go to another adult and you guys get like these, like ego battles and like who's more right and who like has a better, you know thought process and who can win the argument, who's the better lawyer, right? And yet with children it's so simple. I repaired with my seven-year-old the other day and she was like, eh, like, and she was truly like water off the back, like had let it go. I was like I'm getting the vibe from you that you just don't care, like you've already let it go. It was already water under the bridge and so it's like. It's so true. Why is that that when we get older we're less easy to repair with.
Speaker 1:Aside from the obvious, and I think it's what you said, it's the ego piece. A lot of that is there, right? And when kids are little, that's still. The ego isn't so developed, it's less developed, and so they're able to hear you say that and take it in. And so, yeah, she, the your daughter, was like, oh, no big deal, and it probably wasn't, but if she would have carried that with her it would have just kept building. And so it becomes a big deal, right. And so that instance, before you repaired it, it wasn't a big deal, but maybe you would do it again, or maybe it just keeps happening years after years, and then it is a big deal.
Speaker 1:And so, yeah, it's so great to get them right in the moment and be like, oh my gosh, I made a mistake, I'm sorry, I shouldn't have talked to you like that, or I shouldn't have said that, or that was silly of me. Ask you to do that, whatever, I mean, we make mistakes all the time and it's okay. And I think people, just even our own egos, don't want to have to apologize to a little one because you're like, why should I apologize to him? He's only eight or nine. But then you have to think too, that's a human, it's another person. Even though they're little, that's still a human and it's the respect piece.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love that you brought up respect. It was one of the pillars from the play-based preschool that we, by the grace of God, found for our kids because it changed our whole parenting trajectory. They did parent education classes and one of their pillars there was respect for the individual and I that was like I was like huh, we're supposed to respect children, because I grew up in the. You respect the big person, the old person in the room, respect your elders. Children are to be seen, not heard a little bit of that going on where I came from, but I think it's interesting now that the paradigm is shifting to. Our children are human, just like we are. We need to give respect in order to get it, and it doesn't mean being permissive and I think that might be what some people are getting a little off kilter with of let the kids do whatever they want, ask for permission to leave the park, like it's not, like is that okay if we leave the park, honey? Because I hear a lot of that going on and I've done that myself, even like you know, older versions of me.
Speaker 2:Very early on I went through a phase where I wouldn't say no to my oldest daughter, and now, like. I had a conversation with her recently and I go listen, I went through a time where I didn't say no to you and that was a mistake, because you're going to hear the word no frequently. I know you're going to be. You know it's okay that you're upset. Right now the answer is no, it's no and like so realizing that but so back to the whole point was like I see permissive parenting quite a bit and I see that's where we miss the mark. So how do we not swing the pendulum all the way over to permissive, do whatever you want, but still be that authoritative and respectful parent?
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's so good and that's a great question and I think it's challenging because I do think we're in such a new time with parenting and it's really, really new with that millennial generation. I'm older, I'm an older parent for having a young child, but that millennial generation is really the first group that's able to parent differently, I think because of research, I think just because people are more attentive. I don't know what it is, but I think it's wonderful. So, getting back to your question about the permissive, really it goes back to knowing what your values and boundaries are for your family and knowing what you want your family to stand for. So, for example, the park situation like a great strategy for something like that is not asking your child if you can go, but coming up with a plan before you even go to the park, where everyone has expectations of what is going to happen. So, hey, we're going to go to the park today, we're going to be there for an hour. We're getting there at 945. We're leaving at 1045.
Speaker 1:So some kids need more specifics than others, but when kids know the plan, they're going to go with it. They're not going to scream and cry getting off the slide, because you've already prepped them. You've already told them the expectation and they're going to go with it. And a lot of times parents struggle with that and they'll say things like well, my kid does so well at school. I don't know what happens at home. Well, the reason they do well at school is because there is structure all day and there's a plan and they know what to expect and they feel safe in their bodies and it's I always say it's not safe that you're going to hurt them or something, but they just feel safe, that they know the trajectory of what's going to happen next and their nervous system is grounded and like okay, I get it, we're going to be here for an hour, I'm going to play and then we're going to leave. Thank you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's this sense of predictability and.
Speaker 2:I think some kids probably need that more than others.
Speaker 2:I have one child who needs to know what does the day look like, the week, the month, all of it, and she's very I mean, I get these.
Speaker 2:Like she's at camp this week and like every activity she goes to the teacher or the instructor like just has these beautiful glowing things to say and that like feels really warm and fuzzy. As a mom, I know it's, you know I don't depend on it, but it feels good when I hear it, but so. But yet at home she's someone who is not very flexible. She can have emotional outbursts, she can appear as like rigid sometimes and that's because we don't have as much structure at home, and you know. So that's a really interesting piece. Let's pivot the conversation a little bit to talk about play therapy. You're a registered play therapist and let's dig into what's play therapy and maybe some tips for parents to kind of just incorporate like little things at home for like not doing play therapy because we can't do play therapy with our kids necessarily but ways to play with our kids and facilitate the play that can be healing for processing different emotions, et cetera.
Speaker 1:Yeah, of course. So play therapy basically let me just explain what it is. So, um, let me even backtrack. So I'm a registered play therapist and so basically what that is is somebody that's been trained extensively, with a ton of supervision and, um, just education courses on learning about children, child development, how they think, how they play, how they learn, all those things. So I will say this if you do have a child that is really struggling, a play therapist is the best person that you could ever find, and it's a registered play therapist. You could find them under the Association of Play Therapy Only because I say that there is so much training that goes in and it's just such a respectable career and they're so caring. I mean, really, what you have to get to to be a registered play therapist is very intense. So I strongly suggest to do that. But there are so many things that you can do at home with your kids. So a lot of the goals of play therapy are to help the kids learn how to just be who they are right To be, learn how to cope with things, learn to have high health, self-esteem, self-confidence, work on just being, um, just able to speak and put words with how they're feeling, and so, essentially, if you have a child that's going into a play therapy office, we never ask questions. That's something you never do in a play therapy office and you can even do this at home. This is a great activity to do at home. You let the child lead the play.
Speaker 1:So, say, you have a dollhouse. If you have a little girl or a boy, and so your dollhouse and I strongly suggest this too if you have a new little child that you haven't bought a dollhouse for, buy a dollhouse and try to buy it in neutral colors and there's, they definitely have them out there, because I had it in my playroom for years. Little boys love a dollhouse, they love a kitchen, they love all of those things. And so setting up your playroom with all of the things like a kitchen, a dollhouse, dolls all boys and girls love to play with that, especially in the preschool years and then just going in there with them and sitting, not asking them questions, not putting names with anything, not asking them what they're doing, just sit there with them and they will involve you in the play. They will start playing with you and so say you're playing in a dollhouse, you just sit there and they'll, you know, just wait for them and you can even say tell me what you want me to do, tell me who you want me to be, and they will direct you the whole time.
Speaker 1:And then, as you're playing, just let them do it and trying not to use the what, why, how, and it's kind of a game for your brain to not asking questions but letting them lead the play, letting them decide what to do, letting them name the characters, letting them pick the toys to play with, and just it's. That's non-directive play therapy basically. So in your mind, just thinking non-directive, so whatever you do, letting them be the director. And then there's also directive play therapy, which is more a directive part of it, which would be arts and crafts or board games or, um, even directing, even playing with the dollhouse where you are directing and playing and choosing your own character. Even I'm trying to think what else outside games like basketball, those things are all more directive, and so you can do either of those at home and they're great for kids. I love the non-directive, especially because we're so used to doing the directive that it's so good for them to be able to just be the leader in the play with you.
Speaker 2:Right, we're constantly telling them what to do and get your shoes on and get out the door and get breakfast time and all the things, and so for them to be able to take the reins how refreshing, right. And for us to observe just observe what they're doing, what they love. It helps us get to know them. It helps them get to know them. I mean, perhaps the whole goal of parenting is just like individuation, which is heartbreaking and also like it's reality. We are here to guide our kids to like find their true North, to find their true selves.
Speaker 1:Right, that's yes, and that's exactly what it is, and I think the best parents are the ones that do that, and it is the hardest thing in the world, especially like if you, I mean, we just all love our kids so much and we want them to be with us, all that. But the job of us is to let them be someone else and let them go on their own and be this amazing human. And it starts literally. They're given to us for a short time to guide them and to help them be the best person they can be, and to let them go and let them be. And it's hard, it's really really tough to do that, but that's what we're here for, and so learning how to do that, learning how to do that, is really, really important.
Speaker 2:Yeah, some questions I often hear myself asking my kiddos at various times are like what do you think? Like? And this you know you said this is not related to the play therapy at all but just like they'll ask me a question and I'll be like, hmm, I don't know, what do you think? Uh, how does my outfit look? How do you feel? Um, what do you think I should do for X, y, z? Hmm, I don't know what's your heart telling you?
Speaker 2:Because I have my strong opinions. I'm like all the things, like I can I have an opinion, a name, something, and I've got an opinion about it and I'm really conscious to not like stick those opinions on them, because I don't want them stuck on me either, you know. So I have that sense of like be who you are, and I can also feel like how it could be sad to let them be someone who they are, who maybe doesn't align with this like imaginary fairy tale that you had in your head before you had kids of who your kids were going to be, because they're not going to be that.
Speaker 1:No, and I think it's important too, because they shouldn't need you. I mean, they need you right where they need us, but there gets to a point where they don't. They need to be on their own. They don't need you as the parent, and I think that's our goal is to make them humans that do not need us. And that's hard, that's really really difficult.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean it just that gives like. I get a little like, ooh, they're not going to need me.
Speaker 2:Right, and I think, too, circling back around to being an adult who is still hot, still has a mother who wants to mother me actively. I've said, with great respect and reverence, I don't need to be mothered, and I think that's heartbreaking for her because she doesn't understand. And so I can feel like the both sides of it, like wanting to let my kids be who they are and still that that might be heartbreaking for me one day, of who they choose to be, of the path that they choose, and yet knowing that they're on their journey and trusting that it's theirs and trusting that they will thrive. And I don't even want to say be happy, because I think, like, what do we want for our kids? Right, like universally, what is it that we want as parents for our children?
Speaker 2:And I think I don't know what that is Like, I don't know how to put it in a cute little box and tie it up in a bow, like in a sentence, but I would think it's some form of like just being who they are, being really steadfast in what they love, knowing what lights them up. You know, there's many, many things and maybe we can deduce it to one sentence at some point. But what is it that you think universally?
Speaker 1:Because you've worked with a ton of families Like what do we want for our kids as a collective, I think that, honestly, it's being their authentic selves of why they're here, why they were put on this planet, whether you're religious or spiritual. But in my way and the way I think about it is, we're all here for a purpose. We're all here to do something, and it's really we're guiding them to be able to do that, to be their authentic human self, and that's my, and I want them to be happy as well. But it's really we're guiding them to be able to do that, to be their authentic human self, and that's my, and I want them to be happy as well. But it's really being authentic and being who you are and being able to like what you said was a great example with your mom. A lot of people and I'm sure you struggle with it two times struggle with that like push and pull of that family system.
Speaker 1:Cause you were in that system, but now you're creating your own and it's making the other one very bumpy because you're still part of that other system, but it's not this smooth ride like it was before and so being able, as you watch your kids grow and them creating their own families, helping them, make it a smooth transition and still you have this whole, like all these different systems working together.
Speaker 1:And it's not. It doesn't have to be combative, it doesn't have to be tough, it's just this nice flow of the family and when you think of get togethers at Thanksgiving, it can be really, really hard for people because everybody's coming from different places and having that it can be that magical moment of bringing these families together and we that it can be that magical moment of bringing these families together and we joke that it can't, but I envision that it can be If we're creating humans that are their most authentic selves and we all come back together. Imagine that table of everyone just sitting and sharing about this fabulous year that they've had, helping or doing or being whatever it was they were supposed to be. That's really, I mean, that's. It's kind of silly, but that's sort of what I envisioned for families is to be able to come together and not fighting over this, the potato salad or the president or whatever it is. You know, everyone could just have these conversations about, you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no fighting over the potato salad or the president people, all right, put that on the memo for this. Oh my gosh, I love that. Yes, I am here for that vision, anastasia.
Speaker 2:I think I mean, that might be what it's all about. Right, I envision that too. I like that. I'm going to put a pin in that because I think it's beautiful too. I like that. I'm going to put a pin in that because I think it's beautiful. Let's talk about education, today's education system. What you perceive it might be missing and perhaps, like you know, if you had a magic wand, if you had, like, your perfect vision of what it could be, what do you think? That is Because you spent a number of years in the system as a teacher and an administrator, right?
Speaker 1:I was a school counselor for years in the administration and the way that school work yeah, I was in. I mean, I did a lot of that as well. It's hard and I left because it just wasn't fitting me anymore. I love public education. It's sad to me the way it's turning out.
Speaker 1:Um, I actually just did an Instagram live with someone this week and we talked all about just education in general and I just think one of the cool things that happened since COVID is that we have so many options now. Right, there's so many ways we can educate our kids and they're much more acceptable Everything from online school to homeschooling, to there's early colleges now that are happening like in community. I mean, there are so many ways of getting educated and I think the most important thing for parents is really just yourself learning about your community, educating yourself on the resources specifically in your community, the funding that's happening for your public schools, who they're hiring in the specific school you're in, who the principal is in that district, getting to know that person, because every school is such an anomaly of itself and its own structure that you really need to know what's happening in that specific school. A school can have a PTA that has raised tons and tons of money, so there's tons of resources in that school, even if it's in a poor district. So really just knowing where you live, what your schools are like individually, who's running that school, is really important for parents. Also, just knowing the types of schools you can go to, for example, for little ones.
Speaker 1:I am a huge component or proponent of Montessori education. We did that for our one that's 11. He went to all the way to third grade. It's an amazing way to educate children and I strongly suggest parents looking into that because that is very much a lot of the things we've been talking about today. It's really teaching that child to be their own individual person and their primary program starts at three and it is shocking what a three year old can do on their own. It really is, and that's what they teach them.
Speaker 2:It's so cool when you walk into the classroom and they're like pouring these little beans and all this little rice like these tiny and any parent who served rice for dinner like knows that it's the gift that keeps on giving. You find rice like everywhere for days, but in this classroom everybody's like using their fine motor skills to like pour these little tiny containers and it is pretty amazing. I agree, I was Montessori educated in preschool. Yeah, and you know what Like one of the reasons I'm so steadfast of who I am today like and one of the reasons I'm able to step into that so confidently, which you know took a number of years, but that's okay. So, yeah, I'll bring it back to that Montessori education as well. I love that we here have a couple of great Montessori schools and a couple of one amazing play-based preschool too that we're a part of, so where the kids get to just go and climb trees and dig in the mud and there's no formal curriculum involved whatsoever until like after age six, and I think that's super cool, I love it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we have one of those here too and it's an outdoor school. That's called an outdoor school and everything is out. I mean, even in the winter, everything is outdoors and it's all play-based and I think up until that around the same age, and I think it's fabulous. One of the things that's hard for me in the traditional setting is just the amount of screens that the kids are on, and I feel like we are so blessed that we did not have that, being coming from Montessori, I mean, we didn't have any screens for years and now he's in a traditional and we have it all the time, which I don't love. But it's just the nature of school and I'm sure I could find something else if I wanted, but it's working right now. But I find it really hard for those little ones that first kindergarten first, second, on those screens all day and they're on them all day and that is really really, really difficult for me to understand why that's happening.
Speaker 2:Totally. Yeah, we did a tour of a school a number of years ago. My older two were little and we walked into this classroom and it was nap time for some of the kids and the other kids were in a dark room on computers and I was like, oh my God, no, what's happening? I was so sad because, you know, I think we can think about being in the dark, in like on a computer, and then like coming up from that and being like where am I? What day is it? It's very disorienting, I think, for me.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, I know the screens, the screens are a thing, the screens are, for sure, a thing, and I think it's going to take more parents actively on the local level just talking to principals and, you know, actively on the local level, just talking to principals and, you know, being curious and talking to administrators and perhaps suggesting a different way or a better way. And I think that's how real change starts. And so I think I've said this on the podcast multiple times like we do have to be advocates for our kids and all the kids in our districts and our you know it's a thing we need to be involved, at least some of our, you know it's it's a thing we need to be involved.
Speaker 1:At least some of us, you know, if you get called to do that yeah, One of the I've talked with parents about this as well in that, being involved with your kid's teacher in their school, even if you work like, even if you work full time and you, it's hard for you to get in there really building that relationship and connecting with that teacher in that element, especially in the elementary, because those kids need your, our kids need us, Right, and when you build that relationship with that teacher, um, the teacher sees your child in a different way and you have that connection with them and then you're able to even help the whole classroom because you're going to be it's just it's going to look different.
Speaker 1:So I've really, really encouraged parents to be involved in education as much as they can. And I think people get scared of it, they get intimidated, they cause they don't understand it and for me it's been easy cause I've lived it. But I just I think if you can get past that intimidation and get in that school, be part of your PTA, learn what's happening, vote for the boards in your County, Um, it's so, so important, because if you don't do it, it's not, it's just not looking good for public education especially. I mean, it's really really not, Um, and it's sad, it's sad.
Speaker 2:Yeah, a lot of um. So I'm in Florida and we live in a very good school district Quote, unquote I'm doing air quotes and most of the kids, as far as we know, we just moved to a new neighborhood in December, but most of the kids do go to the public school, and actually my kids' cousins included, and everybody seems to be very content with what's happening and pretty involved, and that's great. We've chosen a different way, though We've still, like, chosen to go a little alternative with it, and maybe that won't be forever, who knows? We're kind of taking it year by year at this point. I'm curious, though, for you, what was the straw that broke the camel's back when you decided to step away from education? Because I know a lot of formal educators and administrators who've just said enough is enough for various reasons. And so what was that for you?
Speaker 1:For me it was a lot of things. I mean just the amount. So at the end I was a school counselor in which I loved all the kids, I loved the teachers. It was just the amount of things that they were putting on me, right. So I wasn't even doing counseling, like I was test coordinator and I had come.
Speaker 1:I moved to a new area and the district I had come from was paying me to be test coordinator right, and they were allowing me to come in on the weekends and do it, and so I kind of thought of it as like a second job. So it wasn't really interfering with my school counseling. But when I moved to this other district, they weren't paying me. I still had to do it. I still had to do all the other duties. I did not come on the weekends and it still had to do all the other duties. I did not come on the weekends and it just took too much of what I wanted to do as why I was there, why my education had given me to help the kids. That was one aspect of it. Another was the pay. It was just not sufficient for what we needed as a family and I think that was really hard I do. At times I feel guilty because I knew I was good at what I did and I wasn't there to serve those families anymore that really needed me. But I haven't left. I still do. I consult in schools and I hopefully at this point I'm going to serve a bigger audience and I am still helping, just in a different way. But yeah, and I've had many friends leave the profession and do business or marketing or say whatever it is because of money, just to support their families, and they were great teachers. Testing is another reason people leave Just that structure of that testing and teaching to the test. The resources in the school are so limited, spending their own money on things. I mean I could go on and on about why people just want to leave, which which is heartbreaking because we need.
Speaker 1:I was even telling someone when I graduated from college in 1996, I mean this was a long time, like undergrad I um, I lived in Florida actually and Hillsborough County had started a new magnet program that year and I remember interviewing and it was like a process Like I had to do like three interviews and they were all like team interviews and it was like very special to be chosen for this school and I got the job and it was like a celebration, it was huge. We did like a series of training. I mean I went to school like two weeks before just to learn what this magnet program was all about. And now you look at it, we can't even find people to teach. It's like, and that wasn't even I mean, it was a long time ago, but not that long ago and so it's just the amount of change that's happened in schools since that time till now and we don't even have people that want to be in the classroom. It's really, really sad, yeah, right.
Speaker 2:So we're talking 30 years, right? Am I doing them ish, right?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean that's wild for sure, and it is sad because, if we think about it, you know, kids are spending a quite a big chunk of their day in this setting and I know there are so many caring teachers out there. There are so many, and I think there are some two who are there and don't really want to be there is the perception I'm getting. So there's like this mixed bag. I wish that teachers would be paid more.
Speaker 2:I mean, it's such a, it's such an important job. It's like to affect the lives of these 20, however many kids are in your class. Like it's a big, it's a big big deal. Kids in your class like it's a big, it's a big big deal. And I think it's culturally not as, like you know, prestigious as doctor, lawyer, you know some of these other professions, and I would argue that it's, you know, as or more important than some of these other professions that are, you know, getting paid who knows how much, but a ton of money, you know. So, yeah, I think that's pretty heartbreaking too and, as far as I know, there's a teacher shortage around the country, every state, right, Everywhere.
Speaker 1:And I think that goes back to what we were talking about with voting and who you want your lawmakers to be, and I think we have such a divide right now. I don't think a lot of people even know if they want public education. They don't understand the benefit of it. They don't understand really what it is and why it's so good to have public education, and so we're pulling funding, and I have friends on both sides. I know people that feel like we need to just monitor. However, like have funding from businesses to fund public education, get away from the whole government, and I think, knowing what your stance is on it, we need public education. If we don't have it, we're going to have a mess. Yeah, yeah, um. And so I would love to see it get back to where it was 30 years ago and see these amazing young people in that classroom working with children.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's interesting because so we're in Florida and we have a scholarship now for, like, school choice, essentially, so you can use the scholarship to attend a private school. Or now we have this new scholarship to it's called the personalized education plan and you can use that to home educate your kids, so you can use it for co-op expenses, et cetera. And some people are theorizing like, hey, this is going to kind of defund public education now and I don't know like the intricacies of it that much to say whether it will or won't. I personally like having a choice. I like being able to use that $8,000 or $9,000 to put towards private education or to homeschool, which is what we did this past school year. But I agree, we definitely need public education. But it's like, what's the solution then? How?
Speaker 1:do. How do we make it?
Speaker 2:good, like how do we make it back to something that is respected, the teachers are paid and not overworked? I mean hearing you talk about teachers paying for their own money and you working extra hours. It's like I felt like that sense of burnout just from hearing about it. It was like, oh, that sounds awful yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's not fair, and I think too, like you're saying, it's hard because that money is being taken from public schools, and so I don't know what the answer is, because I agree, having that choice is amazing and they're doing that everywhere. But it's all very purposeful to get rid of public education, and it's like it's a hard thing because you have little kids I have little kids and it's hard because what do you do? Cause it is that's what's happening. They're pulling the money so they don't have to put it into education, so we can get rid of these public schools. They don't want to pay for them anymore, right, and then. But you have families that don't do the work that you've done to figure out what you need to do, and they just send their kid to the school. Not just send their kid to school, but they think the school is going to be what it was and it is not the same.
Speaker 2:Right, right, what's you mentioned testing a little bit and what's your take on that as far as how it's affecting our kiddos, like on a collective level? One of the reasons we've opted out of the traditional path till this point is for the testing.
Speaker 2:I just find it to be unnecessary, and I find it to. I'm like you're trying to put my kid into a box and I'm not interested. Basically, like in a nutshell, because I remember even how those tests were for me. Do you know, however, many years ago, which was a while ago and I remember feeling how unnecessary it was. Even so, what's your take on like testing and how it's affecting the kids maybe that you've worked with, or just that you've seen in your community?
Speaker 1:I mean, I think it affects every kid different and here again, I think every school is different with it. I know public schools around where I live now I'm in North Carolina they have to pass their end of grade test, or I guess they don't pass the grade right? Oh wow, I was just talking with a parent the other day. Her kid, her child, had been working all year A's and B's all years gets the test, fails it Both, all of it doesn't pass any of it. And they made her come back the last day of school and she had, she didn't get to be with her class. And it wasn't just her, I mean, it's other kids that did not pass the test, had to sit and test all day and retake it, retake the test. I think that's torture, I think that's abusive, it's awful and just to her self-esteem, her missing all the things at the end of the day. I'm like what in the world are we doing? That's one thing I think.
Speaker 1:Then I think there's other aspects of it. We go to a different school, we go to a private school which they do a test at the end of the year as well. But it's not pressure, it's more just an evaluation of everything that they've done through the year. And I think it also depends on how, with us, how we look at it as parents, we don't make it a big deal. It's just more like let's see what you've learned and how you score. It's like a national test, that it's just. It's not that long. It's not like the EOGs they call them here end of grade tests which take hours and hours. This is just like an hour of reading. I mean, it's not extensive like that, and if they don't do well, it's not held against them. It's just to see how.
Speaker 1:And I think that was okay. I wasn't upset about that. I was like, yeah, let's just see what you did. And he was fine with it and I think it's because we don't put a lot of pressure on him about it. We're like, let's just see what happens and if you need to work on other things, we'll help you figure that out. But luckily he's fine. But yeah, I think testing, I think it's tough, I think it can be done in good ways and then I think it can be done in ways that are really not so good for children.
Speaker 2:Right, and I think it's our responsibility as parents to perhaps not put as much emphasis on this mattering at all and, just like this is just a test, go ahead and take it and then moving on Right.
Speaker 2:But I think, from my perception, there are some parents who do put weight on it, who want their kids to do well, who, who, and that is what it is, I guess, but I I'm not sure if that's like right or wrong, and maybe it's neither, but I think, if we want our kids to be more relaxed, a little happier showing up, you know, just getting to know what they like to do, then we go, hey, it's just a thing, take it and moving on Right. Perhaps in anything in parenting too, like the way that we have an attitude about anything, is they're gonna pick that up and perhaps carry it with them in the long run, or not? Okay, as we start to wrap up, I'm gonna ask you the three questions that I ask everybody at the end of the interview. Before I do that, though, is there one thing that you wish people would ask you more when you're talking to people, about what?
Speaker 1:you do Ask me more. Just, I think a lot of us carry so much as an adult past childhood trauma, so ask me more about how to help. They all want. They all want to help their kids and they want and this is why I left my therapy office because they just want to send me the child and fix the child. And so it's more about. I wish they would call and be like hi, we want to help the whole family, I just don't need to fix my child. So it's more about how can I help everyone? How do I help what's happening in our family? Because I guarantee you, it's not just that child, there's other things that are happening to create this hard situation, and so I wish more people would ask me how to just help everyone, help the whole family system.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thank you, that's beautiful. I have a one, one challenging child I mean they're all a little challenging, but one that I butt heads with, let's say like that. And she's done art therapy, which was a phenomenal blessing for her and the family and she loved it and it was great, and you know it's interesting. You know it's interesting. Like I have to point the finger back to myself all the time of like this is how I'm showing up for these challenges too. Like because I'm triggered and want to yell doesn't mean that she's the bad kid. Like it means it literally does not mean that.
Speaker 2:And so the mantra that I've been kind of working with in my head when I start to get because we get worried as parents and we go, oh my God, maybe there's something wrong with my kid. I don't want them to have to struggle or whatever it might be. And the mantra that I've found just like so soothing to my nervous system and so spacious is she's not a problem to be fixed or solved. Like she's not a problem. Like she's a human. She's different than me. There she is, here I am, and we're gonna learn to cohabitate.
Speaker 2:Like, if it takes 18 years and I'm sure it will and then, beyond that, we'll still have some work to do, right? So, yeah, thank you so much for the work that you do and the effects that you're spreading out, like this ripple effect, is real. I really do believe it, and conversations like this are so important. So, thank you. Oh, you're welcome. Thank you for having me. Yeah, of course, and actually, before I ask you those three questions, where can we find you, follow you and learn more about the work that you're doing in the world?
Speaker 1:Of course I'm on Instagram. That's the main place to find me right now is just Instagram and it's AnastasiaAruse. It's just my name and I also have a website. It's AnastasiaAruseCoaching, if you want to find me there. But yeah, I'm on social media.
Speaker 2:You can find me and see all the things that I'm doing and connect with me. If you need to and want to Amazing, we're going to put those links down in the show notes. And, anastasia, would you tell me that link also for searching for the play therapist you mentioned it earlier but I didn't.
Speaker 1:What is that like? Let me just look. It's interesting. It's not like as easy as you think it's going to be. It's like a four PT Okay, dot org. Okay, so it's a four, like the number four, or PTorg.
Speaker 2:Perfect, so I'm going to put that in the show notes too, because I think that will be helpful. That's nationwide right To find a play therapist in your area Amazing.
Speaker 2:So, if you know, if it speaks to you and your family, check out that link too. I'm going to put it down below because, like I mentioned, the play therapy, slash, art therapy has been so amazing for everybody in the family. Me, too, like getting to witness how that is and being able to use some of those like techniques at home and even just observing it's. It's beautiful. So, yes, we're going to link all those down below. Um, find Anastasia, follow her and check out her work. Now, as we wrap up, I want to know what's bringing you joy today.
Speaker 1:Oh, of course, yeah. So what's bringing me joy today? Um, I got to go for a bike ride before I started this, and that is my favorite thing to do in the morning. It's sunny and warm, and so that's my joy for the day.
Speaker 2:Amazing. What, if anything, are you reading right now? There's these books by Jen Censura.
Speaker 1:This isn't even about children or anything they're called. You Are a Badass and there are all these badass different books and so I love reading her books and she's very funny. She does one about money, self-esteem, all different ones, but they're really. I don't know if you've read any of them, but they're great.
Speaker 2:I have. I love her books, I love the way she writes. It feels like you're talking to a friend. So the last question is who or what have you learned the most from?
Speaker 1:Oh, I love that. So so many therapists. So one of my favorite people right now is Gabor Mate. I don't know if you know who he is, oh yeah, so he's one of the people I've really learned a lot from. And then also Bruce Perry. He's done a lot of brain research. He wrote a book with Oprah called what happened to you, and it is amazing and we were talking about the generational trauma and it's not about what's wrong with you, it's called what happened to you. It is such a nice book about um just starting to understand who you are, and if you do it on audible it's really cool, because um Oprah has excerpts from her shows and different people that were on there, and then he talks about not what's wrong with them, but what happened and how they're sharing their story and why that has created the life for them that it has, and so it's a great book.
Speaker 2:Oh cool, I just got my new Audible credit for the month, and so that's going towards that one, and actually this is like the second time that this book has come across my awareness in like the last two weeks.
Speaker 1:So yay for that.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much again. This has been an amazing conversation. Thank you, thanks for having me. Hi again, friend. If you're listening to this, you made it to the end of a Raising Wild Hearts episode Yay. Make sure you're subscribed to the podcast so you can hear more amazing conversations just like this one. And here's the deal. If you made it this far, go ahead and hop down on your podcast app and rate and review the show. Your words and five stars truly mean the world to me. Thank you for your support of the show. Thank you for showing up and listening. Week after week, I will be dropping new episodes every Monday, so tune in then and I will talk to you soon.